If only we had paid the annual ₹99 or $0.23, perhaps (just perhaps) #WhatsApp might not have sold out to #Meta. #Privacy #Channel @mastodonindians #india

@Deus @mastodonindians Cant wait for a Whatsapp alternative.

@vijay40 @Deus @mastodonindians

IMHO Signal App is a better alternative to WhatsApp.

cc: @signalapp

@vijay40 @Deus @mastodonindians you don’t have to wait. Delete it and you will never regret it - you’re truly free from misinformation :)
If you really want a replacement there’s always telegram or signal.

@ram @Deus @mastodonindians Telegram seemed like a good fit as there is a lot of my network already on it. However, it seems like Telegram is NOT open source. Only the client is. There is no guarantee that they will not go the whatsapp way anytime in the future.

Signals was the second one I checked out. But there are some reports that they are already adding advertising to the platform.

Maybe we need like a fediverse equivalent of whatsapp. Maybe something which supports xmpp on mobile. So there is no platform lock-in and only protocol lock-in.

@vijay40 @ram @Deus @mastodonindians there is already a whatsapp foss alternative matrix.org search for element X in playstore/f-droid.
If you need fediverse compatible client Sup by pixelfed is coming soon you can also contribute to the project

@vijay40 @Deus @mastodonindians not sure what you are looking for in these apps if you were willing to put up with WhatsApp this long ;-)
Nothing is sacred or secure these days. The safest is talking in person over a cup of tea or coffee I guess 😄

@ram @vijay40 @Deus @mastodonindians

Better check:

https://securemessagingapps.com

and rate the security
🟩 =3 🟨 =1 🟥 =0

Results:

1. Threema (independet & user pays one-time)= 85 = WINNER
2. Session (Loki Coin)= 79
3. Signal (B. Acton Ex-WhatsApp)= 77
4. Wickr (Amazon) = 62
5. Element / Matrix (Amdocs / Moris Kahn)= 59
6. WhatsApp (Zucks)= 34
7. Telegram (Putin)= 29
8. Apple iMessage (Expensive Devices)= 25
9. Facebook Messenger (Zucks)= 25

@Pabamiti @ram @Deus @mastodonindians

User pays one-time is an absolute deal breaker for a country like India. I might be happy to pay, but NO ONE in my network will be willing and that defeats the whole point of a messaging app.

@ajkelkar @Pabamiti @ram @Deus @mastodonindians

I have been wondering why doesnt Mastodon launch a federated messaging service. The technology already exists within Mastodon with Direct Messages feature.

@vijay40 @Deus @mastodonindians @prav Prav App is a desi completely libre Whatscrapp alternative, being developed by free software enthusiasts from India.
Please look into it and see if it can benefit you.

@ajkelkar @Pabamiti @ram @Deus @mastodonindians

Should not be too hard to add I guess, but could be wrong.

@shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav

@Prav looks interesting. But its super confusing for now. The about page says something like:

"Prav App is convenient without vendor lock-in (unlike WhatsApp, Telegram, Signal etc). Except Quicksy, most apps are only convenient and come with vendor lock-in. We are complementing Quicksy with a more sustainable revenue and democratic governance model through a cooperative ownership and control. We are interoperable with Quicksy and happy to see if more people learn about Quicksy from us and join it instead of Prav too."

I dont really know what all of this means. What is Quicksy ? What does Prav app do ? Is it open source ? If yes, then where is the source code ? Who pays for Prav ? What do you mean by 'sustainable revenue' ? What is this 'democratic governance model' ? Do all users vote for every feature on Prav ?

Too complicated for me imo. Can't imagine how its going to be for a non-tech user.

@vijay40 @Pabamiti @Deus @mastodonindians You will have to employ chatGPT to maintain the encryption algorithms with regular security patches in order to NOT pay for someone's time ;-)
open source should not necessarily mean free

@vijay40 @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav

Quicksy is a chat app with user experience similar to WhatsApp, Telegram or Signal (sign up with an SMS OTP and find other Quicksy users automatically). Prav App is similar to Quicksy from a user experience point of view, but difference is in how much control users have over the service. https://codeberg.org/prav/ has the source code. Users pay for Prav. Regular subscription income directly from users makes it sustainable.

@vijay40 @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav We are in the process of registering Prav as a multi state cooperative society (we need 50 members from two states and we are very close to that target now). Users have an option to join the cooperative, if they want to involve in prav decision making. For a non tech users, they probably won't ask these questions. For them, they only need to install the app and enter phone number, start chatting with friends.

@vijay40 @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav Also any suggestions to make the website descriptions less confusing/clearer is welcome.

Hi, thanks for your feedback.

What do you think about the edits made here for the About page?

The main idea is to give users a choice of service providers. With XMPP protocol, you can run a service and talk to any other user with XMPP account.

Yes the app is free software (freedom to run, study, modify, share and share the modified versions).

And convenient sign up using phone number allows your friends to easily use prav app. many people who do not want to use whatsapp, telegram use them to connect with others who might not be convinced about privacy or free software.

XMPP and matrix services are usually complicated for such people to sign up. So, a convenient phone number sign up will make it easy for such users to join XMPP. You can still use any other XMPP service to contact prav users and in particular, you can choose any XMPP service (or host your own) which does not require phone number to sign up. Prav will also have a username sign up option.

Democratic decision making comes from the fact that members of the cooperative society will each have one vote. We are yet to finalize all the details in this aspect.

@ram @Pabamiti @Deus @mastodonindians

Agree. People should absolutely get paid for their effort. But still a messaging app is not useful for me unless my network is on it and I find it impossible that more than 5% of my network will pay for one.

Mastodon is also paying bills through donations while still keeping the service free.

@praveen @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav

So this is what I understand about Prav and the information that should be conveyed in the home page.

1. Prav is an open-source messaging app which uses the XMPP protocol.

2. Prav users can message with any XMPP enabled chat service . like Quicksy, etc. etc.

3. Prav uses phone numbers for discovery so users can upload their contacts and find who else is using the platform.

4. Prav is paid app and charges Rs X/user.

Details about the democratic governance and structuring can be provided through progressive navigation.

That's correct. (The plan is that prav will also give option of registration without phone number in its main release, like username@prav.app will be the user address).

Currently, it is in public beta and you can try for free of cost.

The binary for android app is at https://beta.prav.app

and the source code is here https://codeberg.org/prav

@vijay40 @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav we want to target non technical users so providing all the technical details like it is using XMPP protocol may not be a good idea to be on the homepage. But people who want to learn more can find these from the about page - we also have an FAQ page with even more details. We have updated the about page based on your feedback, please check and see if it is any better now.

@praveen @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav

Yep, about page feels much better now ! I think maybe also consider clarifying the paid aspect of the app. But definitely a big upgrade imo

@vijay40 @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav It is already answered in the FAQ. Do you think we should have it in about page itself?

@praveen @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav

I think it should be in the home page actually. It is a critical aspect of the service, given that most other messaging services are free.

@vijay40 @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav I have asked the team about this suggestion. But I feel we should not put a lot of information in the homepage as well. Everyone visiting the site may not want to know every single detail about the project. So we have to decide how much information should be highlighted.

@vijay40 @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav Though we should try to collect feedback from many non technical people about the website and adapt.

@vijay40 @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav Btw you can actually try the app from beta.prav.app and give feedback about the features. Disclaimer: we are still in beta phase and we still need to complete many steps before we can offer it to the general public.

@praveen @shakil_tcs @Deus @mastodonindians @prav

You are the best judge based on accumulated feedback. Just my 2 cents.